Thoughts from after the game...

[awnawboi21]

1. Harang struggled with his command in the third it seemed. He was either out of the zone or too much in the zone. He bounced back rather well, though.
2. That offense was putrid. We had one good inning. Our 1 and 2 need to produce more than that.
3. Webb is tough
4. Harang pitched better than Webb overall.
5. Bullpen did pretty well. AZ's did better.
6. So very much indifference....it was driving me crazy. Junior jogs down the line on what should have been an infield single. Hatte, Mr. "I play the game the right way" walks back to the dugout head down instead of running to first, EE Ks in 3 straight pitches in the 9th.
7. Corey Patterson can play some damn good defense.
8. I want to see what this team can do with Votto and Bruce playing every day.

[bkleo504]

Good thoughts, also:

1.) Loved EE's patience at the plate, showed a lot of maturity against a great pitcher, hope he breaks out of the slump...
2.) Kepp looked pretty bad, looked kind of lost at the plate...
3.) Would have liked to see Griffey a bit more aggressive ahead in the count.
4.) I love Hatteberg, but that play was uncharacteristic of him. I wouldn't hesitate to go with Votto if he slumps.
5.) The D-Backs are damn good, but I think we could pull out a surprise win against Haren.

[schellis]

Dunn needs to hit either third or cleanup every game.

With Patterson out there the Reds are giving up alot of free outs.

EE I think needs to be dealt. He seems to only wake up and play to his potential after he gets a slap in the face to do so. Every year it seems he starts out horrible both offensively and defensively gets sent down to the minors, then plays well both ways.

The Reds are going to have trouble winning with two defensive challenged OFs. Griffey needs to be dealt as well to open a slot for Bruce.

I would deal EE for Willits, Griffey for Clement if I could and call up Bruce.

A true lead off hitter and two solid OFs will do wonders.

That being said Webb is outstanding and there is no shame in losing to him.

[awnawboi21]

I'd hate to deal somebody with the potential that EE has....but we can only wait so long.

The K in the 9th was really bad, but he saw some pitches which I thought was good.

[schellis]

What is EE's potential though.

.290 with 25 homers give or take and mediocre to above average 3B defense.

Chances are pretty good that he's going to have to switch positions here in a few years if not sooner. His bat just doesn't play all that well as a corner OF or 1B.

If you can get a player that the Reds really need, and a CF that can hit leadoff is such a player then I say deal him off.

[awnawboi21]

Well he finished around .290 last year after a horrible start, so I'd say he's got .310 potential.

I see the point, though. You just hate to lose him. He was our best producer last year w/ RISP.

[schellis]

I don't really put much stock in clutch type stats since they can fluctuate wildly year to year.

I just don't see EE getting much better and I'm really tired of his lazy starts.

If Bowden would go for it I'd send both EE and Griffey to Washington for Zimmerman.

[awnawboi21]

Mar 31, 2008 19:39:21 GMT -5 schellis said:

I don't really put much stock in clutch type stats since they can fluctuate wildly year to year.

I just don't see EE getting much better and I'm really tired of his lazy starts.

If Bowden would go for it I'd send both EE and Griffey to Washington for Zimmerman.

I think it'd have to include one of their OFs since they already have a crowded OF.

[schellis]

Bowden loves him some OFs. Whats one more when you already have two or three to many.

[bkleo504]

I know the K was bad on EE's part, but he knew he had to go up swinging taking his chances near the bottom of the order. Overall, I thought he had a great eye today against one of the game's best so although he certainly has a lot to prove, he didn't do anything to really hurt him today.

[The Duke]

Mar 31, 2008 20:14:45 GMT -5 bkleo504 said:

I know the K was bad on EE's part, but he knew he had to go up swinging taking his chances near the bottom of the order. Overall, I thought he had a great eye today against one of the game's best so although he certainly has a lot to prove, he didn't do anything to really hurt him today.

-Except that throwing error that got Harang the loss.
-Webb will wint he Cy Young this year. Yes, over Santana
-I'll worry about Kepp if this continues
-Dunner with some situational hitting
-If this is what Hatte gives us, start Votto
-Harang will have a good year

[Lark11]

Mar 31, 2008 19:32:28 GMT -5 schellis said:

What is EE's potential though.

.290 with 25 homers give or take and mediocre to above average 3B defense.

Chances are pretty good that he's going to have to switch positions here in a few years if not sooner. His bat just doesn't play all that well as a corner OF or 1B.

If you can get a player that the Reds really need, and a CF that can hit leadoff is such a player then I say deal him off.

I completely agree with this. At this point, I'm tired of Edwin. Most of the male population of the U.S. would give an arm and a leg to play professional baseball, but Edwin seems disinterested at times and never takes advantage of the opportunities he's given.

I used to subscribe to the school of thought that he was being jacked around too much by management, but now I see it differently. He wouldn't be getting jacked around if he actually took advantage of his opportunities.

Jeff Keppinger has never gotten any respect, so the fact that he is in the Majors is because he grabs every chance he gets and performs. He doesn't give anyone a chance to send him down to the minors.

Brandon Phillips is another example. We had about 206 2bs in the mix when we acquired Phillips, but he hit about .689 for the first 4 months and never let up. He won the job and never let anyone else get a sniff at it.

When is Edwin going to do that? At this point, I really question whether his upside is high enough to justify going through this torturous development process with him. Defensively, he is a sieve at third and needs to be moved to a new position, which will just lower the value of his bat. Until then, his bat continues to be erratic and his glove his very detrimental to the Reds.

Instead of Hamilton, I would've dealt Edwin away (to the Giants for Correia/Wilson) and brought in a stopgap at third (Brandon Inge, Morgan Ensberg, etc). The production differential between Edwin and these guys wouldn't have been huge and we could've gotten pitching in return.

All in all, I'm no longer expecting Edwin to be an top tier player. When he was coming up through the system, I had hopes that he would be our David Wright. Of course, Wright turned out to be even better than I expected and Edwin much worse. As of now, I'm not expecting much and waiting for Edwin to prove me wrong. I may be waiting a long time.

[The Duke]

EE will get this year, and part of next year, but by then some of our hitting prospects will start to make their way up and they'll get a shot (Valaika, Griffin, Rosales, Turner, Francisco, Frazier)

[bischof21]

I think Edwin will be fine. It might help that I like the guy and am a little biased towards him.

I think his glove and bat both come around this year. I don't like him hitting 6th though. If I were the Reds I'd move him higher up in the lineup. Not only will that give him some protection but it gives him a chance to drive in runs which is what he does best. He seems to thrive with guys on base but look clueless when th bases are empty.

I think yesterday Baker showed he has faith in Burton despite a bad spring. I really think he wants Burton to be the guy to go to in the 7th. Hopefully Burton comes out of this little funk he is in and returns to last years form.

The team still strikes out way to much. Webb is an excellent pitcher but the Reds really need to cut down on the strikeouts (again this year).

Cordero will be a solid closer in Cincinnati. I liked the way he was pumped up yesterday after the strike out even though we were down 2 runs.

Patterson looks good in the outfield but I don't believe is the guy this team needs to lead off. His career OBP is what around 300? I'd still prefer Hopper in CF over Patterson. Of course I'd rather have Bruce but that doesn't seem to be a possibility at this point.

[awnawboi21]

If EE's time does run out....

I think Valaika has looked pretty good in his short amount of time in the minors. He could turn out pretty well...