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Post by Lark11 on Mar 27, 2008 23:36:00 GMT -5
Now that is some serious posting  Great analysis, and I hope that Dusty has learned his lesson. Gratzi!! Whether or not all the members of the Reds Nation want to admit it, Dusty did put a massive workload on his young starters. We can hope that he has changed his wayward ways, but we can't deny that it happened. It was clear at the time that he was taxing young arms and it has become even more clear with the benefit of hindsight. Fortunately, as KC writer Joe Posnanski recently noted, it's hard to imagine such a massive workload being tolerated in the game today. The uproar and spotlight on such an occurrence would likely be too bright for even Dusty to handle. The media and fans would be up in arms if Dusty tried to do that today. At least, I'm hoping that's the case, because Cueto is exactly the type of pitcher who he might overwork. Cueto has great stuff and great control, so he may be able to work deep into games on a consistent basis. An inconsistent pitcher like Homer wouldn't be able to string together enough quality innings to be overworked. Fortunately, given the new enlightenment in the game, I just don't think it's possible for Dusty to overwork the young guys anymore. |
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jake2bake4
Brett Tomko
"I don't want to play golf. When I hit a ball, I want someone else to go chase it." ~Rogers Hornsby
Posts: 105
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Post by jake2bake4 on Mar 28, 2008 11:43:42 GMT -5
Exactly, even if he hasn't learned, it would never be tolerated again. I would think he learned from his mistakes though and not let it happen again. I'm looking forward to Baker this year. Hes going to keep the fans entertained being more like Brain Kelly for UC than boring Marvin for the Bengals. I think the team will really respect him and I expect him to do well.
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Post by redvol on Mar 28, 2008 21:33:00 GMT -5
Now that is some serious posting Great analysis, and I hope that Dusty has learned his lesson. I think Dusty has learned this lesson. He lost a job he loved and probably reflected quite a bit about lessons learned. I think Wood's breakdown was bound to happen. One major difference in the Reds young pitchers compared to Prior is the years of professional ball pitched. Prior had one year of minor league ball before the 2003 year which likely ruined him. Pitching at USC is never going to be as stressful as any minor league season in any league. |
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Post by redvol on Mar 28, 2008 21:34:29 GMT -5
this is a very good discussion by the way........I can't imagine this ocurring on the current ESPN board. ;D
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Post by walstib on Mar 29, 2008 9:35:35 GMT -5
If a player throws 105 pitches in a game I consider it a cautionary flag. I believe that it is more important to look at how the pitcher arrived at 105, how he built his pitch count. This is somewhat similar to what Steve Phillips was espousing in Lark's quote above.
I use 15 pitches per inning as a benchmark. Look at how many pitches per batter (PPB); and, how many batters the pitcher is facing per inning.
If a pitcher keeps the PPB below 4, then he's optimizing. When he's averaging 3.5 or below he's down right efficient. If this is coupled with averaging 3 to 4 batters per inning you're looking at a pitcher who will go long in a game without stressing his arm.
What I'm emphasing here is how efficient the pitcher is with the pitches he's throwing. Is he keeping the batters off balance? Is he hitting his spots? Is he changing speeds effectively? Are his mechanics sound throughout the game?
Also, VERY important is how well the defense is playing. Are they making plays? Are they not making errors? You can also throw in the umpires strike zone, which will affect a pitch count. If pitchers on both teams are having horrible pitch counts, then I usually can equate that to an umpire with a horrible strike zone.
Let's throw in another variable, the weather. Is it 50, 75 or 100 degrees? Is it humid, windy?
Which one of the below pitch counts per inning do you think is more effective?
Pitcher 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 Total
A 12 15 16 14 17 18 13 105
B 22 18 26 19 20 - - 105
Pitcher A is more efficient. He's got command of his pitches, is probably facing less batters per inning than pitcher B; and, most important is probably having less stressful innings. This is important for both him and his defense. After 3 innings I know that pitcher B is in trouble.
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