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Post by breakerslim on Oct 28, 2019 18:13:26 GMT -5
shameful
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Post by Lark11 on Oct 28, 2019 21:02:28 GMT -5
Yep. Disenfranchise anyone who doesn't agree. Republicans are the anti-democracy party.
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Post by crashdavissports on Oct 29, 2019 10:51:01 GMT -5
Yep. Disenfranchise anyone who doesn't agree. Republicans are the anti-democracy party. You mean the anti-bullshit party? Not all, but many Liberals are whiny ass people that want to change how the world has been for centuries and it is causing many many issues that they in turn love to blame on the Republicans. 1) Not everyone is going to fit in. Not everyone is going to be praised, loved or accepted. That is the way of the world. Continuing to tell kids that if you feel different, if you don't think you fit in, then perhaps you might not "identify" as this or this, then maybe you are this. That is just flippin' wrong, as kids are very much influenced by what they see and hear. You can talk a very normal kid into being "different" just because they know no different. The suicide rate of folks that go through a transgender change is much higher than those who just learn to live with who they are. Is it always a happy life, perhaps not, but that is also a mental issue that folks have to get through. If someone is straight up gay, okay. That is one thing. Trying to convince and say it is okay to change physically who you are is wrong. It is leading to more damaged people, and kids especially don't know what is going on when they have mental issues and they feel unaccepted or different, they reach out and grasp what they can. If it feels too hard, they sometimes lash out and this is when school shootings happen. 2) Yes, let's examine how corrupt the Republican Party is by first examining the Liberals from California, so we have a base line for corruption. That 4 families have basically controlled the state of California for 80 years, increased debt, increased homelessness and lined their own very wealthy pockets. Yes, I know that is how life is. The rich get richer. However, this clan has used political clout and leverage to mastermind many different pocket lining schemes (Squaw Valley anyone?). Not to mention, Pulosi's father was closely tied to the mafia in Baltimore. Her 20 year old brother rapes a 10 to 12 year old girl, gets his trial separated from the other boys, gets off scott free, while the others are convicted...does that not scream corruption as well? 3) How about all these ridiculous damn plans that the Liberals have to keep giving things away hoping to buy the public favor? Free healthcare, free education, free this, free that! Who in the flying F is going to pay for this crap? I will tell you who, the working class, not the 1 percent helping to create a working class. Because you know what, a lot of these damn rich people are also liberals, so I will tell you right now, there will be freaking loopholes written into these new tax agendas to keep the liberals that are pushing these agendas from having to pay out of their pocket. So what happens, the Republican counterpart with money can also see these loopholes, they now take advantage of them, and now the 1% are still not footing the bill, the damn middle class is. Besides, why should the 1% foot the bill? Because they built something from the ground up, worked hard, created a quality product / service that now we should steal from them to give to the poor who want nothing but a free handout? 4) I am tired of Liberals thinking that taking away citizens rights is going to protect them from the bad that is happening in the world. It isn't. All you are doing is squashing freedom and the rights all Americans have. They are naive if they think banning certain guns, creating more background checks, more red tape will keep people safer from those wanting to inflict harm. It will not! Guns are like drugs. They are everywhere. All you are doing is making it harder for law abiding citizens to protect themselves from jackasses that are going to get their hands on guns illegally. I do not own a gun, but I firmly believe in the right to bare arms and protect yourself and your family from those who wish to do harm. 5) The woman's right to chose? What about her choice to practice abstinence? What about her choice to use protection or not use protection in a world that is willingly handing out that stuff now. Are there special circumstances, I fully agree. No woman should be forced to give birth to a baby that was conceived during rape or incest. But if you are mentally stable individual that went into the act of sex knowing what the consequences of sex are, you are not getting a free pass. The boys / men should be made fully responsible as well. It may be the woman's body, but if she is willingly giving her body to the man/boy, then she is willingly giving her body for child birth if proper precautions are not taken to prevent said baby to begin with. What about a woman that willingly enters into sex and winds up with a STD? Is she able to say, hey, this is my body, I don't want an STD, I will just abort it. Is that doable? Of course not. You play with fire, sometimes you get burnt and you live with the consequences. Am I saying that these women with no support system must keep a baby? Nope. But they have to carry to term and spend their time caring for themselves and that baby until she can give birth and send into adoption. I also think women play the handout game in some situations trying to get as much as they can. Popping out babies because they are trying to get more from the system. I think welfare, should be temporary and used to help better an individuals situation, not used as a crutch. If you are a single mother, and you have little financial support to raise that baby, you get one free token, call it your mistake card. If you have two or more children in the same situation, you only get enough welfare to cover you and one child. You get one mistake while on temporary welfare, you don't get two, three, four, eight, ten. There is a lady in this area that just gave birth to her 9th child. Not one kid is in her custody, but all are in her name as the baby daddies have actually mostly stepped up (7 of them). however, she collects welfare and food stamps as if she has 9 kids in her control, and writes most of them off as tax credits. Are you f'n kidding me? The system gets taken advantage of too often. Lazy people that want a hand out, instead of doing something productive. Will she have to work at McDonald's because she is an idiot, yeah maybe, but it is as least productive and she is doing something even if it is not being a trophy wife out shopping for more materialistic crap all day. 6) I also think we should bring God back into our schools, our conversations and our lives (liberals in general do not want this to occur). Oh you can't do that, you are going to offend other people. I don't give a flying Fecal Matter! My country was founded on basic Christian fundamentals, One Nation, Under God. If you do not like my country's founding principles, and my right to celebrate my Lord and Savior, then go somewhere else where your beliefs and founding principles exist. Plain and damn simple. If you don't like it, get the hell out. This is a country born from immigrants, who fled religious persecution to found a country where they could worship their God and live their lives based on those founding Christian principles. I am not opposed to Jewish or Muslim faith, and feel they have the right to practice their faith free from persecution as well. However, our country was founded on, and raised on Christian beliefs, and if we want to say the pledge of allegiance in our schools, and talk about God in our classrooms, then too damn bad! These are American PUBLIC schools, paid for by its citizens and government. Don't want your beliefs being clouded in the public schools, then send your kids to private schools that teach your beliefs. The lack of God and common goodness being taught is the reason so many kids are out of control. 7) Foreign policy? Americans first. I am done. So many many more topics. I am tired of both parties trying to slant the news in their favor, from the left wing news media in CNN, CBS, ABC to right wing news media FOX. So much crap out online you have no idea what is true anymore, but my beliefs are my beliefs and they are free from politics. This is me to the core. That is not changing. If there is a candidate that promises most of this, I am going to side with them. Typically, Republicans embody most of this stuff. Still think everyone should be independent free from the ridiculous political party so they can't be controlled by their party and so opposed by the opposite party. That is why I like Trump, he don't give a damn, this is who he is, this is what he promised and this is what he is delivering. Trump is a independent thinker that ran under the ruse of the Republican card but providing common sense solutions to a Nation so confused and tired of the political machine lining their pockets, promising the world, and giving us squat.
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Post by Lark11 on Oct 29, 2019 11:03:44 GMT -5
Yep. Disenfranchise anyone who doesn't agree. Republicans are the anti-democracy party. You mean the anti-bullshit party? Not all, but many Liberals are whiny ass people that want to change how the world has been for centuries and it is causing many many issues that they in turn love to blame on the Republicans. 1) Not everyone is going to fit in. Not everyone is going to be praised, loved or accepted. That is the way of the world. Continuing to tell kids that if you feel different, if you don't think you fit in, then perhaps you might not "identify" as this or this, then maybe you are this. That is just flippin' wrong, as kids are very much influenced by what they see and hear. You can talk a very normal kid into being "different" just because they know no different. The suicide rate of folks that go through a transgender change is much higher than those who just learn to live with who they are. Is it always a happy life, perhaps not, but that is also a mental issue that folks have to get through. If someone is straight up gay, okay. That is one thing. Trying to convince and say it is okay to change physically who you are is wrong. It is leading to more damaged people, and kids especially don't know what is going on when they have mental issues and they feel unaccepted or different, they reach out and grasp what they can. If it feels too hard, they sometimes lash out and this is when school shootings happen. 2) Yes, let's examine how corrupt the Republican Party is by first examining the Liberals from California, so we have a base line for corruption. That 4 families have basically controlled the state of California for 80 years, increased debt, increased homelessness and lined their own very wealthy pockets. Yes, I know that is how life is. The rich get richer. However, this clan has used political clout and leverage to mastermind many different pocket lining schemes (Squaw Valley anyone?). Not to mention, Pulosi's father was closely tied to the mafia in Baltimore. Her 20 year old brother rapes a 10 to 12 year old girl, gets his trial separated from the other boys, gets off scott free, while the others are convicted...does that not scream corruption as well? 3) How about all these ridiculous damn plans that the Liberals have to keep giving things away hoping to buy the public favor? Free healthcare, free education, free this, free that! Who in the flying F is going to pay for this crap? I will tell you who, the working class, not the 1 percent helping to create a working class. Because you know what, a lot of these damn rich people are also liberals, so I will tell you right now, there will be freaking loopholes written into these new tax agendas to keep the liberals that are pushing these agendas from having to pay out of their pocket. So what happens, the Republican counterpart with money can also see these loopholes, they now take advantage of them, and now the 1% are still not footing the bill, the damn middle class is. Besides, why should the 1% foot the bill? Because they built something from the ground up, worked hard, created a quality product / service that now we should steal from them to give to the poor who want nothing but a free handout? 4) I am tired of Liberals thinking that taking away citizens rights is going to protect them from the bad that is happening in the world. It isn't. All you are doing is squashing freedom and the rights all Americans have. They are naive if they think banning certain guns, creating more background checks, more red tape will keep people safer from those wanting to inflict harm. It will not! Guns are like drugs. They are everywhere. All you are doing is making it harder for law abiding citizens to protect themselves from jackasses that are going to get their hands on guns illegally. I do not own a gun, but I firmly believe in the right to bare arms and protect yourself and your family from those who wish to do harm. 5) The woman's right to chose? What about her choice to practice abstinence? What about her choice to use protection or not use protection in a world that is willingly handing out that stuff now. Are there special circumstances, I fully agree. No woman should be forced to give birth to a baby that was conceived during rape or incest. But if you are mentally stable individual that went into the act of sex knowing what the consequences of sex are, you are not getting a free pass. The boys / men should be made fully responsible as well. It may be the woman's body, but if she is willingly giving her body to the man/boy, then she is willingly giving her body for child birth if proper precautions are not taken to prevent said baby to begin with. What about a woman that willingly enters into sex and winds up with a STD? Is she able to say, hey, this is my body, I don't want an STD, I will just abort it. Is that doable? Of course not. You play with fire, sometimes you get burnt and you live with the consequences. Am I saying that these women with no support system must keep a baby? Nope. But they have to carry to term and spend their time caring for themselves and that baby until she can give birth and send into adoption. I also think women play the handout game in some situations trying to get as much as they can. Popping out babies because they are trying to get more from the system. I think welfare, should be temporary and used to help better an individuals situation, not used as a crutch. If you are a single mother, and you have little financial support to raise that baby, you get one free token, call it your mistake card. If you have two or more children in the same situation, you only get enough welfare to cover you and one child. You get one mistake while on temporary welfare, you don't get two, three, four, eight, ten. There is a lady in this area that just gave birth to her 9th child. Not one kid is in her custody, but all are in her name as the baby daddies have actually mostly stepped up (7 of them). however, she collects welfare and food stamps as if she has 9 kids in her control, and writes most of them off as tax credits. Are you f'n kidding me? The system gets taken advantage of too often. Lazy people that want a hand out, instead of doing something productive. Will she have to work at McDonald's because she is an idiot, yeah maybe, but it is as least productive and she is doing something even if it is not being a trophy wife out shopping for more materialistic crap all day. 6) I also think we should bring God back into our schools, our conversations and our lives (liberals in general do not want this to occur). Oh you can't do that, you are going to offend other people. I don't give a flying Fecal Matter! My country was founded on basic Christian fundamentals, One Nation, Under God. If you do not like my country's founding principles, and my right to celebrate my Lord and Savior, then go somewhere else where your beliefs and founding principles exist. Plain and damn simple. If you don't like it, get the hell out. This is a country born from immigrants, who fled religious persecution to found a country where they could worship their God and live their lives based on those founding Christian principles. I am not opposed to Jewish or Muslim faith, and feel they have the right to practice their faith free from persecution as well. However, our country was founded on, and raised on Christian beliefs, and if we want to say the pledge of allegiance in our schools, and talk about God in our classrooms, then too damn bad! These are American PUBLIC schools, paid for by its citizens and government. Don't want your beliefs being clouded in the public schools, then send your kids to private schools that teach your beliefs. The lack of God and common goodness being taught is the reason so many kids are out of control. 7) Foreign policy? Americans first. I am done. So many many more topics. I am tired of both parties trying to slant the news in their favor, from the left wing news media in CNN, CBS, ABC to right wing news media FOX. So much crap out online you have no idea what is true anymore, but my beliefs are my beliefs and they are free from politics. This is me to the core. That is not changing. If there is a candidate that promises most of this, I am going to side with them. Typically, Republicans embody most of this stuff. Still think everyone should be independent free from the ridiculous political party so they can't be controlled by their party and so opposed by the opposite party. That is why I like Trump, he don't give a damn, this is who he is, this is what he promised and this is what he is delivering. Trump is a independent thinker that ran under the ruse of the Republican card but providing common sense solutions to a Nation so confused and tired of the political machine lining their pockets, promising the world, and giving us squat. So, you agree with the widespread Republican efforts to prevent people from voting? Do you think those efforts are in line with the fundamental principles of a democracy?
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Post by schellis on Oct 29, 2019 13:06:11 GMT -5
I'm extremely fine with them preventing illegal people from voting. If you aren't a citizen you shouldn't have a vote. If you are here illegally you shouldn't even be here let alone have a vote.
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Post by crashdavissports on Oct 29, 2019 15:08:46 GMT -5
You mean the anti-bullshit party? Not all, but many Liberals are whiny ass people that want to change how the world has been for centuries and it is causing many many issues that they in turn love to blame on the Republicans. 1) Not everyone is going to fit in. Not everyone is going to be praised, loved or accepted. That is the way of the world. Continuing to tell kids that if you feel different, if you don't think you fit in, then perhaps you might not "identify" as this or this, then maybe you are this. That is just flippin' wrong, as kids are very much influenced by what they see and hear. You can talk a very normal kid into being "different" just because they know no different. The suicide rate of folks that go through a transgender change is much higher than those who just learn to live with who they are. Is it always a happy life, perhaps not, but that is also a mental issue that folks have to get through. If someone is straight up gay, okay. That is one thing. Trying to convince and say it is okay to change physically who you are is wrong. It is leading to more damaged people, and kids especially don't know what is going on when they have mental issues and they feel unaccepted or different, they reach out and grasp what they can. If it feels too hard, they sometimes lash out and this is when school shootings happen. 2) Yes, let's examine how corrupt the Republican Party is by first examining the Liberals from California, so we have a base line for corruption. That 4 families have basically controlled the state of California for 80 years, increased debt, increased homelessness and lined their own very wealthy pockets. Yes, I know that is how life is. The rich get richer. However, this clan has used political clout and leverage to mastermind many different pocket lining schemes (Squaw Valley anyone?). Not to mention, Pulosi's father was closely tied to the mafia in Baltimore. Her 20 year old brother rapes a 10 to 12 year old girl, gets his trial separated from the other boys, gets off scott free, while the others are convicted...does that not scream corruption as well? 3) How about all these ridiculous damn plans that the Liberals have to keep giving things away hoping to buy the public favor? Free healthcare, free education, free this, free that! Who in the flying F is going to pay for this crap? I will tell you who, the working class, not the 1 percent helping to create a working class. Because you know what, a lot of these damn rich people are also liberals, so I will tell you right now, there will be freaking loopholes written into these new tax agendas to keep the liberals that are pushing these agendas from having to pay out of their pocket. So what happens, the Republican counterpart with money can also see these loopholes, they now take advantage of them, and now the 1% are still not footing the bill, the damn middle class is. Besides, why should the 1% foot the bill? Because they built something from the ground up, worked hard, created a quality product / service that now we should steal from them to give to the poor who want nothing but a free handout? 4) I am tired of Liberals thinking that taking away citizens rights is going to protect them from the bad that is happening in the world. It isn't. All you are doing is squashing freedom and the rights all Americans have. They are naive if they think banning certain guns, creating more background checks, more red tape will keep people safer from those wanting to inflict harm. It will not! Guns are like drugs. They are everywhere. All you are doing is making it harder for law abiding citizens to protect themselves from jackasses that are going to get their hands on guns illegally. I do not own a gun, but I firmly believe in the right to bare arms and protect yourself and your family from those who wish to do harm. 5) The woman's right to chose? What about her choice to practice abstinence? What about her choice to use protection or not use protection in a world that is willingly handing out that stuff now. Are there special circumstances, I fully agree. No woman should be forced to give birth to a baby that was conceived during rape or incest. But if you are mentally stable individual that went into the act of sex knowing what the consequences of sex are, you are not getting a free pass. The boys / men should be made fully responsible as well. It may be the woman's body, but if she is willingly giving her body to the man/boy, then she is willingly giving her body for child birth if proper precautions are not taken to prevent said baby to begin with. What about a woman that willingly enters into sex and winds up with a STD? Is she able to say, hey, this is my body, I don't want an STD, I will just abort it. Is that doable? Of course not. You play with fire, sometimes you get burnt and you live with the consequences. Am I saying that these women with no support system must keep a baby? Nope. But they have to carry to term and spend their time caring for themselves and that baby until she can give birth and send into adoption. I also think women play the handout game in some situations trying to get as much as they can. Popping out babies because they are trying to get more from the system. I think welfare, should be temporary and used to help better an individuals situation, not used as a crutch. If you are a single mother, and you have little financial support to raise that baby, you get one free token, call it your mistake card. If you have two or more children in the same situation, you only get enough welfare to cover you and one child. You get one mistake while on temporary welfare, you don't get two, three, four, eight, ten. There is a lady in this area that just gave birth to her 9th child. Not one kid is in her custody, but all are in her name as the baby daddies have actually mostly stepped up (7 of them). however, she collects welfare and food stamps as if she has 9 kids in her control, and writes most of them off as tax credits. Are you f'n kidding me? The system gets taken advantage of too often. Lazy people that want a hand out, instead of doing something productive. Will she have to work at McDonald's because she is an idiot, yeah maybe, but it is as least productive and she is doing something even if it is not being a trophy wife out shopping for more materialistic crap all day. 6) I also think we should bring God back into our schools, our conversations and our lives (liberals in general do not want this to occur). Oh you can't do that, you are going to offend other people. I don't give a flying Fecal Matter! My country was founded on basic Christian fundamentals, One Nation, Under God. If you do not like my country's founding principles, and my right to celebrate my Lord and Savior, then go somewhere else where your beliefs and founding principles exist. Plain and damn simple. If you don't like it, get the hell out. This is a country born from immigrants, who fled religious persecution to found a country where they could worship their God and live their lives based on those founding Christian principles. I am not opposed to Jewish or Muslim faith, and feel they have the right to practice their faith free from persecution as well. However, our country was founded on, and raised on Christian beliefs, and if we want to say the pledge of allegiance in our schools, and talk about God in our classrooms, then too damn bad! These are American PUBLIC schools, paid for by its citizens and government. Don't want your beliefs being clouded in the public schools, then send your kids to private schools that teach your beliefs. The lack of God and common goodness being taught is the reason so many kids are out of control. 7) Foreign policy? Americans first. I am done. So many many more topics. I am tired of both parties trying to slant the news in their favor, from the left wing news media in CNN, CBS, ABC to right wing news media FOX. So much crap out online you have no idea what is true anymore, but my beliefs are my beliefs and they are free from politics. This is me to the core. That is not changing. If there is a candidate that promises most of this, I am going to side with them. Typically, Republicans embody most of this stuff. Still think everyone should be independent free from the ridiculous political party so they can't be controlled by their party and so opposed by the opposite party. That is why I like Trump, he don't give a damn, this is who he is, this is what he promised and this is what he is delivering. Trump is a independent thinker that ran under the ruse of the Republican card but providing common sense solutions to a Nation so confused and tired of the political machine lining their pockets, promising the world, and giving us squat. So, you agree with the widespread Republican efforts to prevent people from voting? Do you think those efforts are in line with the fundamental principles of a democracy? Obviously you didn't read my post as I said I do not agree with anyone stopping a legal, of age citizen from voting when it is their constitutional right regardless of their political party. I said I understand that republicans would worried because most professors are whiney ass liberals teaching these young minds their diatribe of bullshit. Realized I didn't finish my other post before this. So I am sorry about my comment above. However, it was the basic premise of my post I hadn't finished on my other machine. No, preventing legal citizens who are of age to vote is unconstitutional if the case.
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Post by Lark11 on Oct 29, 2019 17:26:37 GMT -5
So, you agree with the widespread Republican efforts to prevent people from voting? Do you think those efforts are in line with the fundamental principles of a democracy? Obviously you didn't read my post as I said I do not agree with anyone stopping a legal, of age citizen from voting when it is their constitutional right regardless of their political party. I said I understand that republicans would worried because most professors are whiney ass liberals teaching these young minds their diatribe of bullshit. Realized I didn't finish my other post before this. So I am sorry about my comment above. However, it was the basic premise of my post I hadn't finished on my other machine. No, preventing legal citizens who are of age to vote is unconstitutional if the case. No worries. I read it and didn't see it in there. At least we found some common ground: People who are legally entitled to vote shouldn't be deprived of that right. So, that's something, at least.
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Post by Lark11 on Nov 2, 2019 11:35:37 GMT -5
And, not surprisingly, the corruption of the Republican Party extends to North Carolina state politics:
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searay
Bid McPhee
Posts: 1,122
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Post by searay on Nov 3, 2019 13:28:03 GMT -5
Obviously you didn't read my post as I said I do not agree with anyone stopping a legal, of age citizen from voting when it is their constitutional right regardless of their political party. I said I understand that republicans would worried because most professors are whiney ass liberals teaching these young minds their diatribe of bullshit. Realized I didn't finish my other post before this. So I am sorry about my comment above. However, it was the basic premise of my post I hadn't finished on my other machine. No, preventing legal citizens who are of age to vote is unconstitutional if the case. No worries. I read it and didn't see it in there. At least we found some common ground: People who are legally entitled to vote shouldn't be deprived of that right. So, that's something, at least. Republicans want all legal votes counted. Requiring someone to show a legal ID is not suppressing the vote. To suggest otherwise is as ludicrous as suggesting that showing an ID at the airport is somehow racist.
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searay
Bid McPhee
Posts: 1,122
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Post by searay on Nov 3, 2019 13:38:33 GMT -5
So, you agree with the widespread Republican efforts to prevent people from voting? Do you think those efforts are in line with the fundamental principles of a democracy? Obviously you didn't read my post as I said I do not agree with anyone stopping a legal, of age citizen from voting when it is their constitutional right regardless of their political party. I said I understand that republicans would worried because most professors are whiney ass liberals teaching these young minds their diatribe of bullshit. Realized I didn't finish my other post before this. So I am sorry about my comment above. However, it was the basic premise of my post I hadn't finished on my other machine. No, preventing legal citizens who are of age to vote is unconstitutional if the case. You make a good point about the whiny nature of liberals. Just look here on this site. Do you see any Republicans resorting to Twitter to make a point about corruption in the Dem party? I got news for you folks: there's corruption in both major parties. In fact Bernie Sanders will tell you all about the corruption he suffered from the Dem party in 2016. But Republicans don't come on social media in areas such as this and start threads about it. We know corruption in our political parties is not news. I think partisan threads like this are divisive for America. If you want to get this off your chest, fine. Bring it up in the context of corruption in politics in general. But to make it all about one party is partisan and divisive. If Republicans had the inclination, they could match Dem claims about their party tit for tat. For every Trump obstructing justice they could present Hillary deleting e-mails. For every Russians collusion Republicans could counter with the Steele Dosier. For every claim of rigged elections Republicans could bring up Al Franken in Minnesota or Maria Cantwell in WA state. Personally I don't think that's a good use of my time to argue this stuff tit for tat so I rarely challenge such claims brought up by the left. But suffice to say, there's plenty of corruption stories floating around concerning both parties.
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Post by Lark11 on Nov 4, 2019 0:11:28 GMT -5
No worries. I read it and didn't see it in there. At least we found some common ground: People who are legally entitled to vote shouldn't be deprived of that right. So, that's something, at least. Republicans want all legal votes counted. Requiring someone to show a legal ID is not suppressing the vote. To suggest otherwise is as ludicrous as suggesting that showing an ID at the airport is somehow racist. Pretext - a false or weak reason or motive advanced to hide the actual or strong reason or motive. Disparate Treatment - The practice of intentionally dealing with persons differently because of their race, sex, national origin, age, or disability. Disparate Impact - The adverse effect of a facially neutral practice that nonetheless discriminates against persons because of their race, sex, national origin, age, or disability. There are basically no (or, at most, very very few) documented cases of voter fraud. So, if voter fraud isn't actually a problem, then why are Republicans so hell bent on passing voter id laws??? Answer: It's pretext. As argued in all the posts above, Republicans have locked themselves into a party platform that appeals to a minority of the populace. To maintain their hold on power, they must diminish the number of voters who support the other party. Unfortunately for the Republicans, they can't just come right out and say, "we are going to pass laws to disenfranchise minorities because they are very likely to vote Democratic." That would be disparate treatment, which is not going to hold up under legal scrutiny. So, how do they reach the same result in a manner that hopefully (for Republicans, at least) holds up to judicial scrutiny? Answer: Disparate Impact. You come up with a law that appears to be neutral on its face ("hey, let's require all citizens to have a valid ID before they can vote! Because, it can't be discriminatory if we require it of everyone, right?!?!"), but the downstream consequences of which hit minority groups differently than the group in power ("low income minorities are less likely to have valid ID and are more likely to struggle to obtain one, so many of them won't be able to vote"). The ultimate result is the same ("fewer voters who support the Democrats") as it would be under disparate treatment, but the pretext allows the Republicans a very flimsy, half inch of cover to claim that they aren't actually trying to disenfranchise Democratic voters and it allows Republican voters who want to believe otherwise to stick their heads in the sand and delude themselves into thinking that the pretextual justification actually is the true reason. Once people abandon what is true in favor of what they want to believe to be true, then they lose their agency and individuality and become susceptible to whatever logically flawed argument is presented to them. But, here's a hypothetical: Let's say that there were 3 total individual instances of voter fraud. Let's say that voter ID laws would prevent those 3 instances, but would disenfranchise 30,000 voters. Would you support voter ID laws? Would voter ID laws still be worthwhile? Finally, if those 30,000 voters who were to be disenfranchised were Republican voters, then would you still support voter ID laws?
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Post by yorak on Nov 4, 2019 11:05:16 GMT -5
"Do you see any Republicans resorting to Twitter"
?? a certain person comes to mind
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Post by schellis on Nov 4, 2019 13:31:24 GMT -5
I have had to prove that I'm a US citizen no less then five times for my current job. I think its perfectly fine to request proof of citizenship in order to vote.
I think citizenship should be easier though, if you speak the language and have a skill set that can provide income welcome, if you are willing to join the US military for say five years I think thats good too.
But these people that are coming over just for welfare benefits or criminals or heck don't even have a high school education has to stop. We have people here with issues that need to be taken care of first.
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searay
Bid McPhee
Posts: 1,122
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Post by searay on Nov 4, 2019 16:47:32 GMT -5
Republicans want all legal votes counted. Requiring someone to show a legal ID is not suppressing the vote. To suggest otherwise is as ludicrous as suggesting that showing an ID at the airport is somehow racist. Pretext - a false or weak reason or motive advanced to hide the actual or strong reason or motive. Disparate Treatment - The practice of intentionally dealing with persons differently because of their race, sex, national origin, age, or disability. Disparate Impact - The adverse effect of a facially neutral practice that nonetheless discriminates against persons because of their race, sex, national origin, age, or disability. There are basically no (or, at most, very very few) documented cases of voter fraud. So, if voter fraud isn't actually a problem, then why are Republicans so hell bent on passing voter id laws??? Answer: It's pretext. As argued in all the posts above, Republicans have locked themselves into a party platform that appeals to a minority of the populace. To maintain their hold on power, they must diminish the number of voters who support the other party. Unfortunately for the Republicans, they can't just come right out and say, "we are going to pass laws to disenfranchise minorities because they are very likely to vote Democratic." That would be disparate treatment, which is not going to hold up under legal scrutiny. So, how do they reach the same result in a manner that hopefully (for Republicans, at least) holds up to judicial scrutiny? Answer: Disparate Impact. You come up with a law that appears to be neutral on its face ("hey, let's require all citizens to have a valid ID before they can vote! Because, it can't be discriminatory if we require it of everyone, right?!?!"), but the downstream consequences of which hit minority groups differently than the group in power ("low income minorities are less likely to have valid ID and are more likely to struggle to obtain one, so many of them won't be able to vote"). The ultimate result is the same ("fewer voters who support the Democrats") as it would be under disparate treatment, but the pretext allows the Republicans a very flimsy, half inch of cover to claim that they aren't actually trying to disenfranchise Democratic voters and it allows Republican voters who want to believe otherwise to stick their heads in the sand and delude themselves into thinking that the pretextual justification actually is the true reason. Once people abandon what is true in favor of what they want to believe to be true, then they lose their agency and individuality and become susceptible to whatever logically flawed argument is presented to them. But, here's a hypothetical: Let's say that there were 3 total individual instances of voter fraud. Let's say that voter ID laws would prevent those 3 instances, but would disenfranchise 30,000 voters. Would you support voter ID laws? Would voter ID laws still be worthwhile? Finally, if those 30,000 voters who were to be disenfranchised were Republican voters, then would you still support voter ID laws? If as you say there's really not much of a problem with voter fraud then by that same standard I guess requiring an ID would have little impact anyway. It's much todo about nothing
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searay
Bid McPhee
Posts: 1,122
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Post by searay on Nov 4, 2019 16:49:24 GMT -5
I have had to prove that I'm a US citizen no less then five times for my current job. I think its perfectly fine to request proof of citizenship in order to vote. I think citizenship should be easier though, if you speak the language and have a skill set that can provide income welcome, if you are willing to join the US military for say five years I think thats good too. But these people that are coming over just for welfare benefits or criminals or heck don't even have a high school education has to stop. We have people here with issues that need to be taken care of first. Do you think it's OK for our country to ask what you're going to do about health insurance before we let you in? Some folks think that's a question we shouldn't be allowed to ask
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